Weapons and Warfare book.

Discussion in 'General Books' started by Elvenblademaster, Jan 1, 2004.

  1. Elladan

    Elladan Son of Elrond

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    elvenblademaster, why do you have such a problem with the book treating its LOTR subject matter as fact? Tolkien does the same in the book, as has been previously said.

    We know it's not real. But why can't we pretend it's real, and gain a better understanding for it? That's what fantasy is all about. It's not real- but don't tell me that while I'm in constume. ;)
     
  2. Haldir

    Haldir Archer Extraordinaire

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    Lol... Wow that was a good attempt at shutting everyone up! :p [Edit: this was intended to be a reply to nazgul's post]

    nazguls: a lot of LOTR does relate to history as I mentioned a very well done show on National Geographic showed this.

    I agree that it is a good book.

    DohHunter: I gasped quite loudly when I read that. I originally read the 150# and thought "wow". Then I read the 200# and almost hit the roof.

    I wouldn't mind giving it a go though. As in to find out if it is possible. Perhaps I'll ask some people in my club who are Science Students (they can work out the physics of it for me). Then get a few Engineers to build it.

    College does come in handy after all! :p

    Oh and nazguls I'd suggest reading the books. They add a lot to it. Very much worth the read. I only finished them between the release of TTT and ROTK (the films).
     
  3. Elladan

    Elladan Son of Elrond

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    Hey Haldir, think you could get them to make one of those Numenorean hollow steel bows? I'm interested to see if that could actually be done.
     
  4. Haldir

    Haldir Archer Extraordinaire

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    No harm in asking... In all fairness I would say that it is POSSIBLE to make them all with the right materials. It would in fact be quite a lot of fun to do.

    So many things to make and attempt to make! :p
     
  5. Nathan

    Nathan Wielder of the Flame

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    Wait a minute..... Middle-Earth doesn't exist? Heh.
     
  6. Lainovion

    Lainovion Royal Guard of Gil-Galad

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    I have the same sort of enjoyment that Elladan has of this book. It describes the information as if you were reading an acual history book. It is a very effective format, and I personally love. It does follow the events from the movie, but it does include vast amounts of information from the acual books. I enjoy this book as much as I do the acual writings of tolkein, so thats pretty good to me !
     
  7. woodsmen50

    woodsmen50 New Member

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    I enjoyed the book. Face it for nothing else we get to goggle over those swords, shields and armour. At least now they are all in one collection in one book. It's a great addition to all of the other Lord of the Rings library we are all gathering. Hell, years from now we might wish we had bought the book for reference and keepsack
     
  8. nazguls

    nazguls Guest

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    I intend to. After I get tied of watching the DVD over and over again.... if that ever happens.

    But I'm trying to locate a leathered covered edition of Tokkien Books. Some limited edition I came across while surfing the net.
     
  9. nazguls

    nazguls Guest

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    Oh yes, I saw that video that came with the EDVD. The point to note is that Tokkien wrote LOTR using much of his own personal experience growing up.

    But that doesn't make Lord of the Rings any more historically factual than it is friction.
     
  10. Elvenblademaster

    Elvenblademaster New Member

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    Wow theres been a lot of discussion here. You guys all make wonderful points. The main thing that I want to know is why does the WW book say that the bows have such huge draws when, if it is so much like the movies and the movies never say anything about poundage, why does it give the huge numbers why not give a real poundage, like for the Lothorien bow 85lbs that much poundage with sharp tips will go through any armour. The only reason is so that they can make the elves look super duper to be able to shoot so far. I am not trying to change anybodys view of Middle earth, I am trying to prevent people who have not read the real books from possibly embarissing themselves in some way. The WW books says that Mallorn wood would only grow in Lorien, yet one grew in the shire. Now imagine somebody who does not know arguing against somebody who does, they could look pretty dumb when proven wrong.
    Think about it this way are any of you religious, christian, jewish, muslum or hindu. Think now that someone is taking part of your old testament bible (if your not christian then your whatever, I don't know, coran.) and filming the story of moses, but they change what happended, instead of moses leading the people out of Egypt, the filmaker, has Joshua do it and they just cut moses out. Wouldn't that tick you off. The annialation and factual misrepresentation of the truth. Now I know that lotr is not the same as the bible in the way of importance but you have to think of it as something that what once was pure and has now been misrepresented. I am not talking about the films. The WW book does yes go with the movie but, saying that they have actually recovered artifacts is stupid what is the point in doing that, why not just show the picture of the fell beast claw and say, claw of a fell beast, instead of Claw of fell beast unearhted from land near mordor. What is the point in taking a movie and quoting it as fact. Maybe having been homeschooled has kept me from understanding the way movies are translated into books such as the ww but it seems to be that making it in a movie guide fashion would have been more informative. Along with being told that the Lorien bows were made of Mallorn wood and had a draw of 200 lbs for middle earth wouldn't you like to of been told what WETA and the movie people used to make the bow and the real poundage that the actors had to draw. I know I would.
     
  11. NCO MOS18B

    NCO MOS18B Better than you.

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    Perhaps, if the book was talking about the props and the making of the movie, but it wasn't; unlike the other LotR tie in books, this one has to pretend that the world actually existed at one time--that it was real, and there's no other way to do it than make it sound like archeologists uncovered all that stuff. Peter Jackson sees it that way, and you'd know that if you'd have seen the extended FotR docs.

    As for your Moses analogy -- I have no clue where you were going with that, but it reminds me of Mel Gibson's The Passion. He wrote, produced, and directed a movie where he CAST HIMSELF AS JESUS CHRIST. How full of yourself do you have to be to do that?! Man, Mel Gibson is such an ass!

    (Yes, that last bit had nothing to do with the conversation at hand. Sue me.)
     
  12. Elvenblademaster

    Elvenblademaster New Member

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    No I totally see your point there I did not care for the passion either, and I am not a big gibson fan. FREEDOM!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! his best line ever.

    I was just trying to relate it to another history story. I would just have prefered if it did not pretend for it to be real. Don't you feel that them saying those things about the artifacts is misleading and that it takes away from the mystery and fantasy of middle earth. OH well O guess its all just opinion and the may you see the story and I will still get the book just because it and this is something I really like, that it give tons of detail on armour and swords and stuff and how it would have been worn. I would just like to know what the mivie armour was made of and such. Thanks for your views and opinions.
     
  13. NCO MOS18B

    NCO MOS18B Better than you.

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    Actually, I much prefer the "history" angel the filmmakers (and author) took as opposed to a "fantasy" one--I hate magic and the like because it just isn't believable, even in the context of whatever world it's set in. But that's just me, and I can see how one can be annoyed be someone taking the "magic and fantasy" out of what is basically fantasy in the first place.
     
  14. byzantine warrior

    byzantine warrior Autokratos Konstantinou

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    why is everyone arguing about a book that was intended to represent the movies standpoint and not the books. I dont know if legolas's bow was really that spetacular but they made a movie BASED on the books and can do and say whatever they want about legolas's bow and things like that
     
  15. Haldir

    Haldir Archer Extraordinaire

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    Ok well I do really hate to disappoint but if the actors drew anything it would have been very VERY little. I would be surprised if that wasn't added in afterwards by the computer people.

    Don't kill me! My reason for saying this is that not one single solitary arrow was shot in the filming of Lord of the Rings. I suppose I should've assumed this but it disappointed me anyhow.

    I think really what you're looking for elvenblademaster is another version of Weapons and Warfare, would I be wrong? Version 1, we have, this is what happened in Middle Earth etc. Version 2: this is how it was actually done in real life. I wouldn't be sure if they would ever release some of that information though as it might be considered trade secrets etc. Maybe it is all out there. Some is on the Extended DVDs I think.
     
  16. mervenut

    mervenut Wood Ranger

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    Sorry NCO but on Mel Gibson's passion your Wrong! (in the interests of accuracy) Christ is played by James Caviezel (see, http://www.passion-movie.com/english/caviezel.html) Gibson, as far as I can tell in not in the film he just Produces and directs, please get your facts right before having a go at someone.
     
  17. Justice

    Justice New Member

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    Um... Mel Gibson does not play Jesus. never has. In fact I doubt he's in it at all unless it's a cameo. He casted all Middle-Eastern actors.
     
  18. NCO MOS18B

    NCO MOS18B Better than you.

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    Really? I could have sworn that was him in the trailer. Oh well, nevermind then.
     
  19. Elvenblademaster

    Elvenblademaster New Member

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    Ya I guess yout right telling bow materials could be trade secrets, but byz the WW book does not go along with the movie to the extent of which I am talking, if it just went along with the movie, then why are there huorns in the WWbook which were'nt in the movie, and Ents are never mention, which were in the movie? Ents are mentioned only once. Why does it talk about the houses of healing when they weren't in the movie, yes Iknow that the huorns and houses of healing were in the EE, but its possible that someone reading this book has not seen the EE such as me. Why does the WW book talk about sacrifices to Yavvanna whe she wasn't in the movie or the EE, why does it talk about Morgoth hwen he wasn't in the movie.
    This is my last point and then I am not gonna debate any more, everybody has shown good points and strong arguments and this has been fun and educational. The only thing with the WW book is that it gives false info and then gives info which people who have only seen the movies know nothing about, yavanna and morgoth and huorns. see ya'll later.
     
  20. NCO MOS18B

    NCO MOS18B Better than you.

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    Well, with all that mention of things that weren't in the movie, it might give people who haven't read the book a good incentive to if they want to know what they're talking about.