Well actually it was just Me Finrod and Dwarf tosser mostly. But this refers to the now closed thread of the Gilgalad's death, yes we got off topic and yes we got kinda crazy but we were all wrong. We all said that we hated the way that Gilgalad died, in fact I said "what kinda idiot would think that up oh I know PJ". We all thought that GG had died by being hit by saurons mace or sword or something like that but in the non-theater version he was lifted and set on fire by sauron, now we all thought that it was an outrage, a horrible unhonorable death for the elvenking and that Tolkien would never have written. But he did, and not in some faky non published note book either but right in the middle of FOTR. Here is the quote taken from "The Lord of the Rings, the fellowship of the ring, chapter the council of elrond. Gandalf is speaking and he either quotes or reads the scoll of Isildur. " It was hot when I first took it, hot as a glede, and my hand was scorched, so that I doubt if ever again I shall be free of the pain of it. Yet even as I write it is cooled, and it seemeth to shrink, though it loseth neither its beauty nor its shape. Already the writing upon it, which at first was as clear as red flame, fadeth and is now only barely to be read. It is fashioned in an elvenscript of Eregion, for they have no letter in Mordor for such subtle work; but the language is unknown to me. I deem it to be a tongue of the Black Land, since it is foul and uncouth. What evil it saith I do not know; but I trace here a copy of it, lest it fade beyond recall. The Ring misseth, maybe, the heat of Sauron's hand, which was black and yet burned like fire, and so Gil-galad was destroyed; and maybe were the gold made hot again, the writing would be refreshed"............................. Well there it is straight fro JRRT himself, we were wrong and I appologize for my ignorance.