Voting at 16?

Discussion in 'Every Day Debating' started by Blackness, May 24, 2007.

?

Do you think voting at the age of 16 is a good idea?

  1. Yes.

    6 vote(s)
    17.6%
  2. No.

    25 vote(s)
    73.5%
  3. Don't know / Don't care

    3 vote(s)
    8.8%
  1. Warlock Lord

    Warlock Lord I am a Fashion Statement

    Joined:
    Nov 18, 2006
    Messages:
    3,207
    Likes Received:
    94
    Trophy Points:
    0
    Location:
    The Drunken Isle
    Ratings:
    +94 / 0 / -0
    how is anakins point valid when EVERYONE feels emotional about something? sorry, but if people where not emotional, everyone just would not care!!!
     
  2. Mercury7674

    Mercury7674 Music House Member

    Joined:
    Mar 16, 2006
    Messages:
    236
    Likes Received:
    5
    Trophy Points:
    0
    Location:
    New York
    Ratings:
    +5 / 0 / -0
    Exactly, you take it all the way, instead of all this formal crap.
     
  3. Warlock Lord

    Warlock Lord I am a Fashion Statement

    Joined:
    Nov 18, 2006
    Messages:
    3,207
    Likes Received:
    94
    Trophy Points:
    0
    Location:
    The Drunken Isle
    Ratings:
    +94 / 0 / -0
    is there no issue that you are emotionally involved with, that would, lets say... effect your vote???
     
  4. ~Elladan~

    ~Elladan~ A Elbereth Gilthoniel

    Joined:
    Aug 21, 2006
    Messages:
    4,907
    Likes Received:
    215
    Trophy Points:
    63
    Location:
    England
    Ratings:
    +225 / 0 / -0
    Stepping back and being less emotional about an issue does not equate to being uncaring. I'd class myself as a pragmatist ~ ie I consider the practical consequences rather than letting myself get carried away with an emotional response which would normally be based on incomplete knowledge of an issue anyway.
     
  5. Mercury7674

    Mercury7674 Music House Member

    Joined:
    Mar 16, 2006
    Messages:
    236
    Likes Received:
    5
    Trophy Points:
    0
    Location:
    New York
    Ratings:
    +5 / 0 / -0
    Incomplete knowledge? so you can say whether my opinion is incomplete knowledge?
     
  6. Warlock Lord

    Warlock Lord I am a Fashion Statement

    Joined:
    Nov 18, 2006
    Messages:
    3,207
    Likes Received:
    94
    Trophy Points:
    0
    Location:
    The Drunken Isle
    Ratings:
    +94 / 0 / -0
    call yourself what you will... but its not as if your not emotional!!!

    the thing is... teenagers are not the only ones who are emotional... anyone, at any age can be... and so that will effect voting weather 16 year olds vote or not...

    is there a better reason 16 year olds cant vote other than:
    they are too emotional
    they are not mature
    they dont know anything about politics

    ???
     
  7. ~Elladan~

    ~Elladan~ A Elbereth Gilthoniel

    Joined:
    Aug 21, 2006
    Messages:
    4,907
    Likes Received:
    215
    Trophy Points:
    63
    Location:
    England
    Ratings:
    +225 / 0 / -0
    Who made any reference to you at all? Totally emotional responses tend to be narrow, blinkered ones and are often made without full knowledge of the issue. The individual is so wrapped up in their own perception of what's right or wrong that they fail to step back and gather more information before reaching a conclusion.
     
  8. Mercury7674

    Mercury7674 Music House Member

    Joined:
    Mar 16, 2006
    Messages:
    236
    Likes Received:
    5
    Trophy Points:
    0
    Location:
    New York
    Ratings:
    +5 / 0 / -0
    I stated my comment wrong.. I meant who are you to judge whether an opinion is official or not? I didn't mean me in perticular.

    I think were also forgetting the fact that this is only voting, its simply stating who you want in charge, and its true that you need a full understanding in politics. If this was the case of trying to get into office, then obviously thats different. In all, maturity has nothing to do with voting, someone could be incredibly smart in politcs but at the same time be fooling around all the time. R.I.P John Lennon ;)
     
    Last edited: Jun 4, 2007
  9. ~Elladan~

    ~Elladan~ A Elbereth Gilthoniel

    Joined:
    Aug 21, 2006
    Messages:
    4,907
    Likes Received:
    215
    Trophy Points:
    63
    Location:
    England
    Ratings:
    +225 / 0 / -0
    I'm (personally) not judging the validity of your opinion at all. Society has decided that minors shouldn't be able to vote, until they're at an age where they have some life experiences beyond living in a home where, in 'normal' circumstances, everything is provided for them.

    You could just as easily turn this question around and ask yourself the same question about your attitude to younger children ~ at what age should they be allowed to vote, why that age and why are you limiting children younger than that threshold, the oppotunity to express their opinion?

    I originally voted 'yes' on this thread to 16years olds having the vote but understand why others have opposing views :)
     
  10. Warlock Lord

    Warlock Lord I am a Fashion Statement

    Joined:
    Nov 18, 2006
    Messages:
    3,207
    Likes Received:
    94
    Trophy Points:
    0
    Location:
    The Drunken Isle
    Ratings:
    +94 / 0 / -0
    well, i hope you understand the frustration of living in a dictatorship until you reach the age of 18!
     
  11. ~Elladan~

    ~Elladan~ A Elbereth Gilthoniel

    Joined:
    Aug 21, 2006
    Messages:
    4,907
    Likes Received:
    215
    Trophy Points:
    63
    Location:
    England
    Ratings:
    +225 / 0 / -0
    Umhhh yes I understand we all go through childhood :p I don't accept the dictatorship comment though as even as children we all have/had the opportunity to influence those with a vote.

    Playing devils advocate ~ I wonder how many over 18s would have voted for girls getting the vote at 16 (ignoring sex discrimination issues). It's pretty universally accepted that girls mature younger than boys.....
     
  12. Warlock Lord

    Warlock Lord I am a Fashion Statement

    Joined:
    Nov 18, 2006
    Messages:
    3,207
    Likes Received:
    94
    Trophy Points:
    0
    Location:
    The Drunken Isle
    Ratings:
    +94 / 0 / -0
    i dont think maturity is all that big a deal when i comes to voting...

    and you say that youths can somehow influence those with a vote??? surely this is not responsible!!!
     
  13. Cascador

    Cascador Who's Anakin?

    Joined:
    Nov 11, 2004
    Messages:
    30,512
    Likes Received:
    361
    Trophy Points:
    83
    Location:
    Belgium
    Ratings:
    +383 / 0 / -0
    maturity has everything to do with voting, if you can't see that, you're clearly not ready to vote:p
     
  14. Nynaeve

    Nynaeve <a href="http://photobucket.com" target="_blank"><

    Joined:
    Apr 25, 2004
    Messages:
    4,384
    Likes Received:
    89
    Trophy Points:
    0
    Location:
    Back home in Vegas!
    Ratings:
    +89 / 0 / -0
    The age of 16 is there for a reason. 16 year olds have tons of hormones, and this affects their judgement and emotions. Even at 18 this still affects them, but it's starting to get under control. And 16 year old are just learning who they are, and what they believe in. They are still at home with their parents, not out in the real world for themselves. Some are not even able to drive yet, and may have just gotten their first jobs, and still in high school. All of the learning experiences that happen out in the real world, that teach to how to control yourself, think for yourself and handle your emotions have not really begun yet.
    Voting comes down to a matter of where the average 16 year old is at this point in their lives, and the majority are still not ready for the real world, ready to be out on their own, and be true adults.
     
  15. Blackness

    Blackness Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Nov 28, 2006
    Messages:
    2,947
    Likes Received:
    145
    Trophy Points:
    63
    Ratings:
    +145 / 0 / -0
    Lol, you're saying that those less than 18 don't know who they are or what they believe in?
    What are they then? Animals? Not sentient?
    Many people are never able to drive.
    Handling emotions... would you clarify that a bit, as i can't really understand what are you talking about...
    I believe most 16 year olds are completely ready to live on their own, if they chose to do so.
    In nature, animals are pretty much adult from the moment they can sexually reproduce, and i don't think it's such a big difference with humans, there is a difference, yes, but not a very big one.
    I'm 16 and I know what i believe in and what i want, i also realise that my opinions might change as i get older, but i don't think it will be some huge change or anything...
    I didn't make this thread just like that..
    Many organisations have seen that older teenagers have a lot more interest in politics than ever before, and that they would like to be a part of that.
    So, they are interested in politics, and they know, not as much as 18+ year olds :rolleyes:, but pretty much.
    What i'm trying to say, that they are fighting for their rights, and they will eventually win.
     
  16. ~Elladan~

    ~Elladan~ A Elbereth Gilthoniel

    Joined:
    Aug 21, 2006
    Messages:
    4,907
    Likes Received:
    215
    Trophy Points:
    63
    Location:
    England
    Ratings:
    +225 / 0 / -0
    I still lean towards letting teenagers aged 16-17 yrs old having the vote, based on the following reasons (applicable to the UK):

    - You can work (full-time) and pay taxes from age 16. If they're contributing to the cost of society they should have a say in what form that society takes. (Although that sort of suggests that people who don't contribute, whatever there age, shouldn't be able to vote :eek:)

    - You can legally consent to relationships without parental approval, although marriage still requires consent before 18. So 16 years old can start a family and will be supported by the state in doing so. The 18yr old marriage 'rule' seems a bit redundant when the reality of what is allowed is considered ~ surely stable relationships should be encouraged not barred?

    ~ Compulsory full time education ends at 16 which suggests society believe they know enough.

    There seems to be conflicting signals to those aged 16/17 whether society sees them as grown up or not. I can understand the view that young people should see more of life before they can vote too though.
     
  17. Unraveller

    Unraveller <a href="http://photobucket.com" target="_blank"><

    Joined:
    Aug 19, 2004
    Messages:
    4,128
    Likes Received:
    62
    Trophy Points:
    0
    Location:
    t' hEmerald hOile
    Ratings:
    +62 / 0 / -0
    You are only allowed to work full-time at 16 if you have left school and even then you are restricted to day-time working. You are also prevented from working in the 'Adult Entertainment' industry.

    You can (generally) consent to a relationship only with another Minor. Different places have different laws but the most flexible one I know of only allows an age gap of 10 years when one partner is between 16 and 18.
     
  18. Mercury7674

    Mercury7674 Music House Member

    Joined:
    Mar 16, 2006
    Messages:
    236
    Likes Received:
    5
    Trophy Points:
    0
    Location:
    New York
    Ratings:
    +5 / 0 / -0
    This is voting, not trying to run a whole country! sure its true that I'm very emotional at my age, but my previous comments have nothing to do without controlling them, trust me I can control them, I just express them that way. Personally I have travelled around europe, and I have done alot of things and seen alot of things, and now I currently live in the USA. So I do have experience, obviously not as much as a 30 or 50 year old person has. But I think its fair to say alot of 20 year olds and older still have bad jobs, they lack education and still you see them voting, and alot of them haven't even travelled. Its true that I have alot to learn, but that all comes along with mistakes and first-hand experiences, and its best to learn them at an early age.
     
  19. Cascador

    Cascador Who's Anakin?

    Joined:
    Nov 11, 2004
    Messages:
    30,512
    Likes Received:
    361
    Trophy Points:
    83
    Location:
    Belgium
    Ratings:
    +383 / 0 / -0
    indeed learn at an early age, unfortunatly that has not much to do with voting itself. Afteral we do not vote ourselves if we should allow teenagers to learn about politics at a younger age. I'm all for the idea. But until the time comes that it will happen, then you are not ready. As you said yourself you still have much to learn, which is not your mistake but a flaw in our educational system I guess. So do not think that we see you as flawed. Maybe we do see 16 year olds as immature, but I for myself don't judge upon that as I was of course 16 myself and immature myself (heck I can still be immature now! lol) But there is a difference in an immature character and an action of immaturity. Even people who are mature can "act" immature from time to time, but an immature character will always be immature. I don't say everybody at that age is like that, but a great amount of teenagers are, which of course influences if you are ready to vote at an age of 16
     
  20. Blackness

    Blackness Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Nov 28, 2006
    Messages:
    2,947
    Likes Received:
    145
    Trophy Points:
    63
    Ratings:
    +145 / 0 / -0
    Lol well this is very unfair.
    Everyone has a lot to learn, because learning doesn't stop at the age of 18.
    I know some things better than you, although you know most of the thing better than me.