Staves

Discussion in 'Fantasy Weapons and Armour' started by Doombringer, Jan 20, 2004.

  1. Foe Hammer

    Foe Hammer Gûd Daedheloth

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    Thank you Kit for your input! I don't think that it was ever being disputed that there are 6 points on the top of the Gandalf the White staff being formed by the "lattice work" parts. It is the point formed by the 3 main support pieces in the middle that is missing on the picture of the UC replica. The Fall 2003 catalog clearly shows this part on the movie prop, but not on the UC replica which is directly next to it. I am not trying to start any arguments here, just trying to explain things better to avoid any misunderstanding. I think that gandalf23 is the only other person that sees what I see. Anyway, I really appreciate your input into this! :)
     
  2. Elladan

    Elladan Son of Elrond

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    Kit, how are the staffs coming along? Will we be seeing them soon?


    EDIT:

    Gandalf's Staff - The only change made to Gandalf's staff is that the original prop has an oval shaped hand blown glass ball. We can not make a production glass ball in an oval shape that wil stay in tolerance and fit in the metal crown consistantly so the choice was made to go with a round ball. We compensated by increasing the diameter of our ball to be in between the length and width of the oval prop.


    That's what everybody's been harping about. The 'top' on the white staff must be the glass ovoid/ball. It's circular on the reproduction, and thus less visible.
     
    Last edited: Jan 31, 2004
  3. swordsman

    swordsman New Member

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    BLades has already order a supply of Staffs. Steve Brown is reluctant to start taking pre-orders until we have a set date of expected arrivial from United. After all the christmas crunch and the demand for all the past pre-order items we would rather wait and miss a few sales then begin taking pre-orders and have folks hammering us with e-maisl on where there products are. SOrry but unles he changes his mind we are on old right now for pre-orders.
     
  4. Yasmar

    Yasmar New Member

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    Re-read Kit's reply carefully. The first staff he describes (with the glass ball) is actually Saruman's staff. He mistakenly typed "Gandalf's staff" for both descriptions.
    Foe Hammer and Gandalf23, I also see what you two are talking about. I have added to Doombringer's diagram (mine in red)...
     

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  5. Foe Hammer

    Foe Hammer Gûd Daedheloth

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    Yes, that it what we are referring to. Thank you for putting it in a picture. Again, I want to emphasize that I am not saying that UC is making a huge mistake or anything like that. I'm sure there is a good reason, such as manufacturing limitations, that caused them to make this decision.
     
  6. Elladan

    Elladan Son of Elrond

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    My bad. I thought that maybe the 'top' of the White Staff was a glass bead/marble, and it had to be reshaped for the replica. Which would actually be pretty cool, and explain why it was visible against the gray walls behind Sir Ian but not the white backdrop of the picture...
     
  7. GaydalfGayhame

    GaydalfGayhame New Member

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    This is in response to Kit Rae's comment on Saruman's staff and the debate on whether or not it is tapered to a pointed with the ring. As we can all see, it is clearly tapered to a point with the ring in the photo kit provided. And from this photo I assume it is the deleted scene where Saruman is ejected out of the Wizard's order by Gandalf in ROTK. But my main reason for this post is to point out what Kit said about there not being this feature of the staff in the fight scene in FOTR between Gandalf and Saruman. I have just finished watching the scene and indeed I saw this feature on Saruman's staff. Contrary to what kit has implied.

    My explanation for this would be that Christopher Lee's character is the one who is in possession of the staff in question and that it is the original and dominant prop he uses throughout the trilogy, while the staff that kit is referring to is another prop that is not tapered to a point as to avoid injuries or something along that line ( I assume) when it was used in the fight scene by a stunt double of Christopher Lee. So from this I suggest that there are two staves of Saruman, one that is tapered to a point and one that is not. The staff that is tapered to a point is the prop used by Christopher lee and the staff that does not end at a point is used by his stunt double.

    So here we can say that Kit is reproducing the legitimate prop but just not the one used exclusively/mostly by Christopher Lee. However, I am not adament about this and on the contrary, I am rather happy and excited to know that the staff is being replicated. One design or another, I am looking forward to purchasing both Gandalf's and Saruman's staves.
     
  8. GaydalfGayhame

    GaydalfGayhame New Member

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    And another thing if I you ever find the time to look at this post again, Kit. I read that the staves will be shipped in 2 pieces, I was wondering how the staves are connected/pieced together and how long each piece will be. Will the staves come in a manner where the shaft is one piece and the longest while conncected to the crown that is the shortest piece? Or is it designed so that both pieces will be of equal lenght?
     
  9. Saruman

    Saruman New Member

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    Well, I doubt it makes much difference bringing up the changes now anyway. We all can see the difference, and as they'll be shipping soon, I don't think United Cutlery has any plans to go back on all the work they've done to re-design and re-make the staves - even if it does mean they'll be more accurate. Blades by Brown have started accepting pre-orders on the staves now, just incase anyone didn't know. Does anyone know when they'll actually start shipping, I'm assuming BBB have a date because they said they wouldn't be accepting pre-orders until they had it.
     
  10. swordsman

    swordsman New Member

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    Well what you said is partly correct. We have started to accept pre-orders at Blades by Brown. We still do not have an exact date when they will arrive. We were told by our field representitive Rick MAdison, that they should be shipping in a few weeks. So we are estimating around the last of this month or the first of next month. These are going to be a popular product, good thing is that it will be a regular stock item and not a limitd one. So we won't have to sweat the supply of them. :^)

    The product you see is what United has offered us as the finished product. There will be no changes. I personnaly thik they are beautiful, even if I havent had the chance to hold one. I think they will do well by what we are seeing in orders. People have looked forward to these for a long time.
     
  11. NateDogg2

    NateDogg2 New Member

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    Any chance for Gandalf the Gray's staff in the future Kit??? Any response would be greatly appreciated.
     
  12. HybridK03

    HybridK03 KID A

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    Last week I was told that the Staff of Saruman will ship on Feb. 16th. I have an order, so we'll see. And I guess the Staff of Gandalf will ship in March sometime.
     
  13. nasnandos

    nasnandos New Member

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    Here is a better pic of the Gandalf the white staff showing the primary differences between the props and UC's. Note the photos say Weta props but Weta actually contracted someone else to make the props for the film.
     

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  14. gandalf23

    gandalf23 The White Wizard

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    well, that settles that, only a small difference but i do wish they were the same, just that small part makes a difference to me... but i will be buying this anyways...
    thanks kit
     
  15. NateDogg2

    NateDogg2 New Member

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    The WETA prop looks like it is made out of stone. That could easily be some feathering though.

    I hate to pester, but what about Gandalf the Gray's staff Kit???
     
  16. Elladan

    Elladan Son of Elrond

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    Wow, Kit. The White Staff looks beautiful. So clean and brilliant...

    I'm guessing it was too hard to make the 'tines' of the staff extend all the way up and through the crown? That would be quite intricate....

    And please say the White Staff is shipping soon! :D
     
  17. Fourpaws

    Fourpaws Wielder of Slack

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    Not to flog a limping horse, but...

    I've just had too much time on my hands and just went frame by frame on my DVD through the Gandalf/Saruman fight scene to take a look at Saruman's staff. I paid particular attention to the bottom Saruman's staff. There are scenes where there is clearly a ring towards the bottom of the staff as it picking up light and you can see the tapering of the end. Switch to another cut and the ring is gone, another cut, it is back. Pick any scene where a stunt man is involved and the staff will have the flat end that UC is currently making. Most of the scenes with Chris Lee has the other end and ring (but not all).

    If you move forward in the movie to Rivendell and Gandalf's flashback to his and Saruman's confrontation on top of Isengard, you can clearly see the tapering ended staff with the ring.

    Obviously, more than one staff prop. Obviously one is the hero prop and the other is a stunt prop.

    Just know that UC is doing an outstanding job and they care. They have to work with what New Line gives them.
     
  18. nasnandos

    nasnandos New Member

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    New Line claims what we were given is the "hero" prop of Saruman's staff, but it doesn't matter now. I do know there were many props. Just look at how many times the pattern in the glass ball changes from scene to scene. Each one was hand blown glass, so they all vary slightly.

    Here are some photos of UC version and the prop of Saruman's staff.

    As far as Gandalf the Grays staff, we may do the first version (with pipe) if UC's initial staff sales are successful. We'll have to see. It would definitely be resin. We really have no desire to do Gandalf's other staff since Noble has already made it. There would be no difference in ours and theirs other than price.
     

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  19. Fourpaws

    Fourpaws Wielder of Slack

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    Hey Kit, thanks for the additional photos.

    I'm just picking nits in the movie more than anything. My comments are not meant to be critical of your or UC's work. After all, you have to work with what they give you. And if they give you a staff and say it is the hero prop, you gotta go with them. They are the authority. I accept that.

    My observations are more to make one scratch their head and say: "What am I seeing here..." Similar to the age old quandry of the original series of Star Trek command shirts. They appear gold on the screen (due to lighting and film stock), but in reality they had a green hue to them. (nerd alert!) :ufo:

    I'm really looking forward to getting UC's staves. I have a place for Gandalf's reserved by Glamdring and a place for Saruman's on my "bad guys" wall.

    Thanks!
     
  20. Fourpaws

    Fourpaws Wielder of Slack

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    Hey Kit,

    One more question.

    How do the staves ship in two pieces? Do they come apart like a pool cue in the center?

    Or is it just the tops that come off?

    Thanks.
    :monkeydan