Should Marijuana & Other Drugs be Legal or Illegal

Discussion in 'Every Day Debating' started by Turambar, Mar 22, 2004.

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Should marijuana be legal?

  1. It should be legal

    46 vote(s)
    59.0%
  2. It shouldn't be legal

    26 vote(s)
    33.3%
  3. Undecided

    6 vote(s)
    7.7%
  1. Turambar

    Turambar Harebrained Staff Member

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    There is a small land, somewhere between England and Germany, where the use of marihuana products, and ownership to certain extent is legal. Though others follow suit, there are still many countries where it is highly illegal. Why? Is there any reason to forbid these substances? We know that a guy named J. Edgar Hoover decided them to be wrong and declared war to Marihuana and asked (others say forced) many other coutries to join him in his battle.

    As a Duchman, I am very curious what the rest of the world thinks of marihuana products and their government policies on this issue.
     
  2. Radagast

    Radagast Art House Member

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    Re: Marihuana: Legal/Illegal

    The debate in Canada rages every so often, but it hasn't been made legal yet. All I know is the fact that here in Canada, a trafficing fine for dealing Mar. is less than than most other offenses. It makes little sense to me. But the way I see it is that if one has health issues and they choose to smoke it to freely knowing the consequences, let them. Maybe making it legal to the public, but it being only acquired through a government source.
     
  3. Justice

    Justice New Member

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    Re: Marihuana: Legal/Illegal

    Marijuana useage is akin to alcohol. When you use it, you get high. You make stupid decisions. You try to drive a car and kill a family of four returning from dinner.

    Lawmakers who want to legalize drugs would like to make it sound like it's fine, that users will stay in their houses and fall asleep safe and sound and wake up the next morning refreshed. Not only does marijuana harm internally (brain cells, lungs, etc.) but people high on it are more dangerous than people that are drunk. Then there's the crime involved in growing it, selling it, traficking it, and millions upon millions of teens who then get addicted to stronger drugs.

    Tobacco is addictive, but does not alter ones conscious at all. Alcohol does, but it's illegal to be drunk in public. Marijuana has both of these properties, and hence has the same dangers as both of these. There are enough ruined lives to say that neither alcoholism or drug abuse leads to anything but the gutter.
     
  4. Skyanide

    Skyanide The Big Meanie Staff Member

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    Re: Marihuana: Legal/Illegal

    I've yet to see someone high on pot try to start a fight or beat their wife.

    There is no study that proves that pot leads to stronger drugs. People who have done stronger drugs also usually have tried pot. I'm sure they breathe air and eat food too, but nobody is banning breathing and eating.

    Alcohol by far has ruined way more lives BY FAR, yet it is legal, heck, even SANCTIONED by the government, because it MAKES MONEY for them. So I have to laugh when the government, especially the US, tells the public that they make it illegal to protect the public. It's one of life's biggest hypocracies.
     
  5. Justice

    Justice New Member

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    Re: Marihuana: Legal/Illegal

    Okay, a few things being ignored here.

    First of all, I never said pot makes a person violent. Although there are no studies to suggest pot leads to stronger drugs, it definitely leaves people open to the stronger and much more dangerous ones compared to someone who stays out of that environment altogether, that is undeniable.

    Alcohol has not ruined lives, alcoholism does. Same goes with addictions to drugs, anyone I know who has taken them has ruined their lives a lot quicker and at a much younger age than I have seen people who ruin their lives with alcohol. Alcohol isn't illegal, but drunkeness can be. The government doesn't pour those pints of liquor down your throat, but a man who doesn't know when to stop and gets into a car is in for some jail time.

    Marijuana has only one purpose. People don't take hits just to do it, they go for a high which is easily comparable to drunkeness, however it pounds the brain as opposed to the liver.

    Public safety is the key. If it can be proven to be publicly unsafe, it can be restricted. Smoking is in designated areas only because second hand smoke is almost as harmful as first hand (I have my doubts about that, but I'm not some independent organization paid by anti tobacco lobbyists). You can drink, but if you're drunk you better stay home. However marijuana attracts a much younger crowd, and I'll be the first to admit people in my age group are legendary for making bad decisions.

    Then there's the question of making it legal. If it was, where can you smoke it? House only? What about areas that ban smoking? In resturaunts? Do you want your kids to be breathing that in and watching that man acting high, and since it's pefectly legal your kids might get interested?

    Rather than proving what marijuana doesn't do, try figuring out how it makes things better. Alcohol doesn't make things better either (save the old joke about drinking 'til your wife looks good). However I don't drink alcohol and I doubt I ever will. I have issues against both except for that alcohol doesn't always lead to drunkeness, but what else does marijuana do?

    Basically, if you have to alter your state of mind, I'd re-examine what kind of life your living. I know a few kids at college who don't drink (Liar! no... actually I do) and the only reason is that they don't need to be blotto to enjoy life.



     
  6. Skyanide

    Skyanide The Big Meanie Staff Member

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    Re: Marihuana: Legal/Illegal

    Pot leaves nobody any more open to harder drugs than alcohol or anything else. If a person had addictive tendancies, it wasn't the pot who gets them into harder stuff. Perhaps if we all hid at home under our beds we could protect ourselves even better.
    Depends what you mean by "alcoholism". If you mean "alcoholic" then that is an addiction. Many date-rapes, pregnancies, and motor vehicle accidents are caused by people who are not alcoholics.
    I've gotta ask. Have you ever tried pot? Because that statement alone really shows that you know very little about its effects.
    Just like bars, children aren't allowed in. How many restaurants are you concerned about people at the bar getting out of control. Half the time I can tell you that you couldn't tell if a person was high. As for second hand smoke, how different is that from cigarettes now?

    I occasionally used pot when I was younger; it didn't ruin my life, didn't kill my brain cells (at least not too many), and the main reason that I stopped 12 years ago was because I quit smoking cigarettes, which I figured WOULD kill me.

    I work in a tech field making on average of $150G a year, and if you talked to half of my coworkers who also make the same amount, they've tried pot at one time too. It depends on the induvidual, not the drug.
     
  7. Justice

    Justice New Member

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    Re: Marihuana: Legal/Illegal

    You said something similar before sky, I don't have to be hit by a car to know I won't like it. I will never smoke pot because not only will it strongly hurt my relationship with my family and friends, I will be the worst form of human being, a hypocrite.

    trying pot and being addicted is two seperate issues. I smoke cigars, but I am not addicted. i've been busy so I haven't purchased any for weeks. A lot of people try pot, I am not worried about them, but those who feel the need to make it legal obviously use it enough to be considered an addiction because they are worried about being caught with it as it is currently illegal.

    And the reducing crime issue people bring up is a horrible arguement at best. "If we make pot legal, there would be less crime". Give me a break. If we made murder legal, there would be a whole lot less people in jail because they did nothing wrong. Same goes for rape, domestic violence, tax fraud, grand theft, you name it. At my college I argued with a guy (dreadlocks, sunglasses, and sandals, the whole works) who was asking for petitions to help make marijuana legal because he said I was a fascist if I didn't help them out. I stopped walking, walked back and asked him to explain. He couldn't. I asked him which political party he was going to vote for. He said he didn't vote. Then I asked him where he works. He said he currently did not have a job. So then I wanted to know why I should make marijuana legal if it ends up creating a bunch of people like him, and at that point he really didn't want to talk with me anymore. And I can see that every time I go to class, there will always be three or four kids who I can tell are stoners and will not get anywhere in life until they clean themselves up.

    So you, and maybe some friends, had nothing permanently negative happen. Good for you. My best friend in High School is now basically mentally retarded because he started hanging out with people, smoking a little innocent pot, but then he eventually fried his brain on acid. I didn't say pot leads to stronger drugs which you tried to reiterate in your last post, but hanging out with people in that sort of environment does. Often times people just can't back out of an addiction like you did. So then we have to pay for these people to go into rehab because most can't afford it themselves.

    Any or all laws set for legal marijuana are basicaly poorly assessed, not specifying if they are held accountable to the same laws as cigarettes. It's illegal to sell cigarettes seperately, but then can you hold marijuana to the same standard if you sell it out of your home?

    I think this issue is not just rights, which is what is mainly being argued, but also lifestyle. You say you and a few friends turned out fine. I wonder how many of you there were doing drugs, and what the actual percent of successful people to those now still addicted, or in jail. And whther or not you want your kids to repeat what you know now was a mistake.
     
  8. Skyanide

    Skyanide The Big Meanie Staff Member

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    Re: Marihuana: Legal/Illegal

    My mother used to say, "How do you know that you won't like broccoli unless you try it?". Smoking pot is hardly getting hit by a car, that is a gross exaggeration. That would be like comparing your cigars to getting hit by a car. Choosing not to do something is one thing, but professing to know something based on ZERO personal knowledge is something different. It's like you telling your mother how little childbirth hurts because most people you know survived.
    Pot only differs from alcohol in that the government has made it illegal, so the only way to obtain it is through the criminal system. A perfect example is Canada back in the early '90s. When a carton of cigarettes hit $50 a carton here, it was only $18 a carton in the US. People were making TONS of money smuggling cigarettes from the US to Canada. What did the government do? Lowered the price of cigarettes so that they were nearly equal. Did smoking increase? Not really. But people stopped buying from smugglers, the smugglers went away. Crime is there because the market is there. Nobody buys from a drug dealer because they want to or that the price is fair, it's because they have no choice.
    That's unfortunate, but that's not because of pot. That's because of acid. And guess what? Both are illegal where you are. So how can this be? Do you mean that the government holding his hand and making it illegal didn't save him? Are you aware that illegally sold pot can be mixed with other chemicals? But without any way of monitoring it, ie. by leaving it illegal, nobody can stop that from happening.
    Well, out of all the kids I know that went to school that smoked pot, only two that I know of ever went to jail, one was not drug related. I do know more people than that have gone to jail for DUI, not including one that didn't go because he's pushing up dandilions from wrapping his car around a tree.
    If you look back, I never said once that it was a mistake, please don't put words in my mouth. I said that I don't do it now mainly because I don't smoke cigarettes (and the occasional cigar is still worse BTW), and the other reason is because I fly planes and would rather not get tested positive for drugs.

    That said, I am not advocating the use of drugs, I'm just trying to give my opinion that in the big scheme of things pot is no worse to me (as a drug) than alcohol, which is allowed by the government. The same laws and guidelines that are applied to alcohol can be applied to pot.

    As for my children, I know well enough first hand that if a kid is going to try, they're going to try no matter how hard you try to preach to (or at) them. I feel that I'm open and honest with them enough that we could discuss the situation. And from what I can tell, they feel that way too.
     
    Last edited: Mar 25, 2004
  9. Jessehk

    Jessehk The introverted

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    Re: Marihuana: Legal/Illegal

    It's strange,Whenever there is a topic in the debate forums, I always agree with your opinions and POV Skyanide. I guess we see things the same way.
     
  10. Skyanide

    Skyanide The Big Meanie Staff Member

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    Re: Marihuana: Legal/Illegal

    :) Glad to know that I'm not alone.

    PS: I loved "The Chrysalids". John Wyndham rocks. DotT is one of my favorite books.
     
  11. byzantine warrior

    byzantine warrior Autokratos Konstantinou

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    Re: Marihuana: Legal/Illegal

    Drugs are an abomination to society and should be outlawed. The smoking of hashish (as we in greece call the scourged substance) damages the brain and leads to deep depressions and to suicidal thoughts if one continues to smoke the substance there is a chance that they will act on those thoughts. I mourn for those hooked on drugs
     
  12. Skyanide

    Skyanide The Big Meanie Staff Member

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    Re: Marihuana: Legal/Illegal

    I mourn for drug addicts as I do for alcoholics.

    I mourn for people who die from cancer from cigarette smoking.

    Marijuana is no more damaging than either smoking or alcohol. Why is it permissible for the government to condone and make money off the latter two but make pot illegal?
     
  13. Turambar

    Turambar Harebrained Staff Member

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    Re: Marihuana: Legal/Illegal

    There is no proof that substances in Canabis proucts lead to psychosis, suicidal behaviour, schytzophrenia or related mental deseases. Theory is that people susceptible to these disorers take refuge to these products to ecsape their tendandcies.
     
  14. byzantine warrior

    byzantine warrior Autokratos Konstantinou

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    Re: Marihuana: Legal/Illegal

    I have no idea why you people want to legalize a deadly drug and is blamed for countless deaths as for proof. proof??? just read the news paper I rea;;y dont care what you people say next because im never viewing this thread again. Call me stupid or whatever you want


    Byz.
     
  15. Skyanide

    Skyanide The Big Meanie Staff Member

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    Re: Marihuana: Legal/Illegal

    Nobody is calling you stupid Byz, even though I don't agree.

    Alcohol and tobacco EACH is to blame for way more deaths than ALL other drugs COMBINED, and both are condoned and taxed by our governments, and you feel this way about marijuana?

    I just don't think that you see the irony in this.
     
  16. Jessehk

    Jessehk The introverted

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    Re: Marihuana: Legal/Illegal

    As said before, I feel like Skyanide is speaking for me. see above for my thoughts
     
  17. Sindarking01

    Sindarking01 Lord Of the Grey Elves

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    Re: Marihuana: Legal/Illegal

    SKy & Jessehk I agree with you both, but I try to stay out of these debates because I don't know enough about the issue and I don't presume to. I just want to thank you for having an opposing view.
     
  18. curunir's bane

    curunir's bane Kwisatch Haderach

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    Re: Marihuana: Legal/Illegal

    OK here are my thoughts on this. I want everyone to know that i am not criticizing anyone, i am just stating my opinion. First off i want to make a statement to what Byz said. Yes pot has caused many deaths, but so has alchohol.

    In my opinoin, Pot isn't any worse than drinking. Yes it alters your state of mind, but it should be controlled if it were to be made legal. I personally think that the effects of drinking are much worse than pot. I agreee with SKy that no one has ever beaten someone while on pot as opposed to someone who has while drinking. I think too many people think that if pot is legalized there is going to be this huge rampage of people smoking it in their cars and out in public and will be able to smoke it freely anywhere at anytime. Pot, IMO, could be legalized if it is controled like alcohol.

    Now I want to talk about pot ruining peoples lives. I highly believe that pot will never ruin your life even if it does lead you to do worse drugs (which, by the way, i think that it doesn't) . A relative of mine did tons of drugs back in his day. He did acid, cocaine, pot, and he was a heavy drinker. But you cannot stand there and tell me that drugs ruined his life, because he is a successfull lawyer today. So that is definately an incorrect statement. Now does pot ruin some peoples lives? Yes. But so do many other things, like drinking or smoking cigarrettes.

    so there's my 2 cents for right now. i'll post more later.
     
  19. Radagast

    Radagast Art House Member

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    Re: Marihuana: Legal/Illegal

    I think this is one of the greatest points made so far.

    Just for reference. I have several friends that smoke weed. Personally, I wouldn't say they are ruining their lives anymore than those who drink.

    Tur, what are the regulations over there in place with the legalization?
     
  20. curunir's bane

    curunir's bane Kwisatch Haderach

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    Re: Marihuana: Legal/Illegal

    Yes, i would also have to agree.
     
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