Should Greece be excluded from EU?

Discussion in 'Every Day Debating' started by anonymous, Mar 7, 2010.

  1. Foinikas

    Foinikas Playing backgammon!

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    Slack in Greek public workers?Hahahaha! :p

    The chaos and bureaucracy along with the usual slackers working in public services is legendary here.There are even comedy episodes talking about how public services employees do nothing all day than scratch their balls or do nothing.
     
  2. Sevi

    Sevi Pocałunek!

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    lol that is true. Everyone's dream is to work to public services cause then you get paid doing nothing as Foinikas said. Right now all the changes that they government made is mostly about public services employees. I hope they keep it there and not doing the same to the private businesses.
     
  3. Turambar

    Turambar Harebrained Staff Member

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    lol - that poses a problem...

    I mean, it's easy to fire the bottom half and extend the working hours of the rest. I mean, it would take a right old cold-hearted sun of a b to do it. But I am sure it wouldn't be all bad for Greece.

    However... that would extend the unemployment problems - and there's probably some social security which would cover a lot of costs for the gouvernment to start with. The only benefit is that this creates a healthier investment climate, which is something Greece desperately needs...

    Soooo.... what do my Greek friends say? :)
     
  4. Foinikas

    Foinikas Playing backgammon!

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    Sevi is right.Every Greek mother's dream is for her child to get a work in the public services because they can hardly kick you out of your position if you find a job there.Unless the political party(the government)changes or there's some serious allegation of someone stealing money from the public services,you can work there without getting fired for some stupid reason.But if the politicians gave at least half the money they benefit from their political positions and profits they make from their investments and sponsors...the country would be saved.A parliament member's salary here is about 3,000 Euro per month or more.
     
  5. Sevi

    Sevi Pocałunek!

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    I say we start taxing churches and half the problem will be solved...
     
  6. Turambar

    Turambar Harebrained Staff Member

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    Haha! €100 church membership tax. One way to make for a secular state :p

    You... actually mean that the PM salary should be increased, so they don't have to rely on abuse of power to make for a good living, as they do now? Personally, I think that PMs and ministers shouldn't be involved in any business. At all. But hey, this is The Netherlands :)

    But... the thing about the public sector is; they're the gouvernment. If need be, even the constitution can be changed. But it'd probably be political suicide. However, if the alternative is national bankrupcy, this solution should be considered and - even - executed. If the EU and Greece won't be able to figure it out and the IMF needs to step in, there's no choice about radical changes in the public sector. It would simply be demand.
     
  7. Foinikas

    Foinikas Playing backgammon!

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    No no!You can't tax the church!Tax the politicians instead!
     
  8. Sevi

    Sevi Pocałunek!

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    What?? Why CAN'T you tax the church? Tax both!
     
  9. Foinikas

    Foinikas Playing backgammon!

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    You can't!Tax the politicians!
     
  10. Sevi

    Sevi Pocałunek!

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    Church has wealth beyond imagination. Why shouldn't we tax it? Don't say we can't give me at least one reason.
     
  11. Sevi

    Sevi Pocałunek!

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    I don't think he meant that. I think he meant that if the members of the parliament gave the money that they earn from abuse of power and their sponsors, then the country would be saved. Their salary is already more than high.
     
  12. Foinikas

    Foinikas Playing backgammon!

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    No,I said exactly the opposite.Their salaries are too high and they get too much money from investments and sponsors.
     
  13. Justice

    Justice New Member

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    After listening o a few points over the radio, what I heard was his. 1 out of every 3 people in Greece are employed by the government. The salaries, pension costs, medical benefits, and the fact government workers get paid 14 months salary over the course of a year isn't helping either.

    The Eu had a social contact about limiting debt, and Greece has gone way over it, and Germany has already loaned Greece 50 billion Euro I believe.

    California has the same problem. We have workers retiring in their early 50's, and getting paid nearly 100% of their total salary in pension costs for another 30 years. Government workers don't produce anything. The private market does.

    A hunk of steel or a mould of plastic doesn't have much value. Put 100 hours of labor into steel and you have a car, use that plastic to make computers, you create value. Value is created in the labor of the people who put their work into it. If you create a system where 1/3rd of the people don't do ANYTHING but take money and delegate regulations and rules to everyone else, of COURSE you're going to have financial collapse. Business owners are fleeing California for this very reason. California was ALMOST dissolved as a state out deficit is getting so bad.

    So, people can bash capitalism and the free market all they want (maybe not in this thread, but frequently in others) that system creates wealth. Our bad economy is at 10% unemployment. Places like Spain have had 20% unemployment for a long time, and for similar reasons, an over bearing, large scale socialist style bureaucracy.
     
  14. Foinikas

    Foinikas Playing backgammon!

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    Please kick us out of the EU so we can have this beauty back again!


    [​IMG]




    At least back then I knew how much money I had.Now 5 Euro seems pathetically few money and it's much more than 1000 drachmas.
     
  15. Skyanide

    Skyanide The Big Meanie Staff Member

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    Hope it's made out of rice paper, because you can only buy food with a currency that has value.
     
  16. Turambar

    Turambar Harebrained Staff Member

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    ^_^

    Foin... a country that's bankrupt can't pay for a new currency. You'd better adopt sea shells as legal tender..

    Anyway, there is to be a European bail-out. So I'm sorry Foin :eek:
     
  17. Foinikas

    Foinikas Playing backgammon!

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    I have marbles...I HAVE MARBLES!pLEASE let me trade them for food and water...

    Ok seriously...from what I heard we just got some new loans plus Papandreou went to Obama.
     
  18. Turambar

    Turambar Harebrained Staff Member

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    Oh yes. Ask the African-American for Change. Pap must be very desperate ^^

    But I think Europe took an important step. From what I understand, Europe reiterates loans to Greece, which means they take the risk. Hence, the interest rates will be much lower. And let me tell you that the current interest rates on Greek gouvernment bonds is the most important reason for the budget deficit. It also means that Europe - that is, its members - take the risk over those bonds, which must be regarded as a serious support measure.

    I seriously think that Papandreou is making a fool of himself by knocking on the door in Washington, by the way. The US will be in no way inclined to bail out a foreign gouvernment, given the liberal meritocratic sentiment there. Maybe he does it to get support back home ("see, the rest of the world won't help us; I've tried everything. We MUST resolve matter here").
     
  19. Foinikas

    Foinikas Playing backgammon!

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    Papandreou is kinda like...half-american or something.He is pro-American as you can't imagine.Well it's a tour.First he went to Merkel,then to Sarkozy,now Obama.
     
  20. Turambar

    Turambar Harebrained Staff Member

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    Naw. In good tradition, he's fleeing the angry mob and prostesting peasants back home :p