Post Peak Oil Society.

Discussion in 'Every Day Debating' started by bloodfiredeath, Sep 19, 2011.

  1. bloodfiredeath

    bloodfiredeath Die by the Sword

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    Just wondering whether or not anyone here had given any thought to what may occur post peak oil?
    For those who don’t know the term peak oil; It basically is the point in time when the maximum rate of global petroleum extraction is reached, after which the rate of production enters terminal decline.
    The way we approach even the most basic of our menial daily tasks will be affected. Creating a dilemma that will cause human culture and modern technological society to change drastically.
    This change may well come suddenly in the space of days or weeks, or be drawn over years. To be honest it may well already be underway! Just look at the increased cost of anything consumer based in recent years.
    Imagine waking up one morning and finding that your job is redundant (due to it being Technologically based, or even just reliant on power), and you are short on food and water and cash is not worth the paper it is printed on. On top of all this you are trapped in a city with millions of over people in the same boat! How is it all going to pan out?
    Would we regress back to an agrarian society?
    I like to think so, and the damage done by years of high density farming would slowly be undone due to the lack of chemicals,fertiliser and oil.
    However, how would such a society be set up?
    The power vacuum left after the demise of fossil fuels could possibly be filled by some of the vast multi national agribusiness giants. However without the means of controlling their large holdings, chances are they could not hold Governments/countries to ransom.
    I believe there is a chance that Governments, or a Central World Government (NWO) would try to take control of such assets by force in order to quell populations into subservience.
    Cities would serve no main purpose anymore, apart from possibly becoming havens for black marketeers, opportunists, and most other forms of criminal activity. (Not much different from now! lol)
    The possibilities are endless, as to how it might go.
    Point is…are you prepared??
     
  2. Foinikas

    Foinikas Playing backgammon!

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    I know that Saudi Arabia and some of the gulf countries will go back to zero and have their pride fall again since nobody will care about these "backwards-living" countries after they run out of oil.All support will be withdrawn and their economy and egos will collapse :p
     
  3. Overread

    Overread Wolfing it up! Staff Member

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    It all hinges on how much alternative fuel research is done and then also implemented before the oil crash. Some countries, like Germany, are taking a serious look at this and already making good preparations for an oil-free world. Whilst many many others are dragging their heels, or pottering around with ineffective solutions (biofuels).

    I think the problem is that there is just soo much money tied up in oil and the whole usage of oil that many of those people in power are reluctant to push away from it, heck a clean alternative fuel could ruin many governments source of income from fuel tax alone.

    In the end I suspect that directly oil driven functions of society (ie your cars and machines) can be switched over to electricity and that that in turn will be fuelled by nuclear sources (unless something big comes along to replace nuclear) which at least gives a relevantly clean fuel save for the vast problem of storage and treatment of the waste product (not just storage but long term). It is however a risk since many weaker, poorer nations that adapt to the new nuclear would also have more intensive to build and arm warheads - the problem not only being that these nations would now command a much more powerful international seat than they otherwise would have before, but also because many more unstable countries have very little to use if they did indeed use a nuke (even if it was a weak one).

    Going back to fuel electricity driven cars and services could certainly keep many urban areas running without problems (you don't need more than 30mph at best for urban travel) with industry and larger vehicles able to soak up the remaining oil until such time as electric engines can be made with as much pull economically.

    There is also the waterdriven fuel source (who's name escapes me) which is billed as being the future of energy, by both being easily accessible and also very clean to run - however its not yet ready and it seems to be very uncertain as to if/when it will be ready for use - let alone who will push for its mass production onto the market.
     
  4. Anduil

    Anduil New Member

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    There are alternative ways of producing power of any kind... In Greece we use sun power and wind power... There are not equal to oil but if there will be a better project in those powers and develop a good plan, Greece will not need oil in few years.

    As for your question if we are prepared to an event of no oil left... And cities starving... and other sad events... I believe that the best way to survive is to go away from huge cities. Where there are many people there is fire...

    What i think for myself is to go to my grandpa's cottage and raise my own chicken and trees. And become a farmer... Its a logical solution
     
    Last edited: Sep 21, 2011
  5. bloodfiredeath

    bloodfiredeath Die by the Sword

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    I think a lot of the areas who are reliant on oil for monetary gain, will be the hardest hit. I am not even sure some of those Gulf countries are sustainable once the oil is gone. Probably turn into a Mad Max style wasteland!! :p

    I guess a lot of people would say that the technology has already been developed, but is being held back by either Large Corporations (who may or may not be involved in the Oil industry or its subsidiaries) buying up patents and companies, or Government Organisation's who are in "bed" with the aforementioned Industry. It almost feel a case of too little too late to be honest, and producing alternatives that are within the price range of the average consumer does not seem to be a focus of anyone.

    The idea of harnessing the Sun and Wind is great and I am ashamed to live in a huge sunny country, that has a perfect desert zone in the middle of it that could have hundreds of square kilometres of solar panels on it, but doesn't. Thanks to the tyranny of distance and lacklustre leadership by the Government, it is deemed unviable or a pipe dream.


    So if we are heading to a collapse, what are you doing to prepare??
    Have you even given it any thought??
    Do you have enough skills to survive such an event??
     
  6. ~Elladan~

    ~Elladan~ A Elbereth Gilthoniel

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    Power production isn't really the issue as that problem is surmountable with existing technologies ~ as hydrocarbons diminish the economics of renewable energies become more attractive. Biofuels are in my opinion a non-starter because they diminish the area available for agricultural food production.

    Hydrogen looks like an attractive way forward for transportation although suitability for large vehicles, air & shipping is doubtful?? Many military vessels use nuclear reactors for propulsion so that could be expanded within strictly controlled fleets.
    http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/science-environment-14976893
    http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/business-14979817

    The real problem is neither of the above but the role of fossil fuels in the production of agricultural fertiliser ~ without that or some sort of new synthetic or naturally occuring equivalent requiring less energy to produce/harvest we'll be too hungry to worry about anything else :( If you're a risk-taking investor consider investing in shares which focus on or hold reserves of potash!

    It's shocking really that governments aren't preparing at anything like the speed needed. The only upside of fossil fuel depletion is that it could force us, kicking and screaming in many cases, to live more in balance with natural resources.
     
    Last edited: Sep 21, 2011
  7. Anduil

    Anduil New Member

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    We will return back to hand tools to harvest! hahahahahahha...
     
  8. Overread

    Overread Wolfing it up! Staff Member

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    The biggest hit for the lack of fertilizers will hit the poorer nations - many of which after the "green revolution" that the EU and other groups pushed onto them are not, in effect, addicted to fertilizers; what with many tropical based soils being poor for nutrients and nutrient retention the many who have been pushed from nomadic to sedentary life will quickly find the lack of fertilizers renders the land barren
     
  9. StirlingNewberry

    StirlingNewberry New Member

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    Sure, I've written on this – for money even. How long do you have?

    I could send you the draft one of the "Dominion" novels which is an SF series I am working on where the 22nd century was basically a race between carbon depletion and global warming. It wasn't pretty.