Obamacare

Discussion in 'Every Day Debating' started by Julie, Sep 27, 2013.

  1. Julie

    Julie Well-Known Member

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    Huh, I'm confused, they're talking about it again in senate, but I thought a (watered down) obamacare already passed senate a while back??

    This is funny: :)

    I really don't know why free health care for everyone (but higher taxes in return) is such a problem!

    Strange, strange Americans...
     
  2. AlphaAlex

    AlphaAlex Official Forum Nuisance

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    Americans = strange duh lol :p
     
  3. JNK

    JNK King of tards

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    well, it depends... if taxes are like in some EU countries, it really sucks...
     
  4. Sparrow

    Sparrow Well-Known Member

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    They've been passing ObamaCare in stages, the last of it to be put into action and funded this year and next... problem is the ****ing Conservatives are threatening to block funding. The Healthcare Industry is very much like the Military-Industrial Complex in this country; they're both so far up our asses there's no getting them out.
     
  5. Overread

    Overread Wolfing it up! Staff Member

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    Not to mention the cold war era propaganda still exists in America, both in segments of the political and the population; as a result things that sound "too communist/socialist" can quickly get derailed or even cancelled. It's a throw back and something that the US has been particularly slow to shed and I suspect won't be able to until some of the older generations leave positions of power.

    The point about the industry being too strongly involved in government is another problem; there are too many people with personal interest and financial gain to be had in preventing a shift to a free health system in the USA. Hopefully pressure and time will get the policy through, but Obama has a long and tough fight to get it in place - not to mention then keeping it in place and expanding upon it.
     
  6. Lord Yuan

    Lord Yuan Death-Thousand+

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    Because nobody here cares about the poor or disabled. The fit survive the unfit don't, all so the fit can afford the latest iphones and dump on golden toilet seats. You have the right to live, unless it costs too much.

    Everybody pretends there is no value on human life but they throw up their arms to be categorized and numbered while lying to themselves. This country is on the verge of a resurgence in social Darwinism while simultaneously denouncing darwin and insisting the Earth was made in seven days.

    The Democrats and Republicans are both to blame though, they tug the masses around on a leash shifting their attention from real dilemmas and instead force them to look at trivial things. Like the whole "Obama is a Muslim thing" and how the Democrats make it sound like climate change is the only problem in nature that matters.

    People are only voting against things in this country, not for anything they actually want. If you can draw enough ire towards somebody you can block anything they do from passing. The republicans calling the healthcare act "Obamacare" are propaganda geniuses, slander the name and you slander the act. How could any respectable hot dog eating patriot side with a gay Muslim advocate?
     
  7. olivia_the_lamb

    olivia_the_lamb Moderator Staff Member

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    Basically, the majority of the country doesn't understand how socialized healthcare works for the people, how it works for the doctors, or anything about it other than the fact that: social=socialist=communists=fascists=this-is-a-free-country-aint-havin-no-commie-bastards to the majority of Americans.

    I, for one, am all about socialized healthcare. I don't see how you can watch the documentary Sicko and think otherwise. There's a lot of issues with Americans and not understanding government/healthcare/general human rights.
     
  8. Overread

    Overread Wolfing it up! Staff Member

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    The problem is schools never really teach how society works; they just expect you to pick it up as you go along. The thing is along side that you have the media always exposing government corruption or poor spending so the people end up very disillusioned as to the ability of the government to run institutions.

    You also hear a lot of calls from the middle and richer classes saying things like "I don't want to pay for poor people they should get better jobs" or other similar lines of argument. The problem is that these people forget that not only is the system they are paying into going to be there for them when they need it; but also that with the costs of living and the general social and economic setup you'll never reach a point where everyone can work in a job and earn sufficient to cover serious medical expenses.

    It's far more practical to spread the cost and have it as a social system. I'm surprised that the whole "by the people for hte people" or similar lines of campaigning is not used or gaining stronger support - then again I guess in the USA the anit-communist stance makes it much harder to argue such cases without quickly being branded a commie - who are the "enemy" (even though they all buy everything made in China and have most of their debt owned by China :p)
     
  9. Sparrow

    Sparrow Well-Known Member

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    I never watched 'Sicko'... I liked his documentary 'Bowling for Columbine' so I might give Sicko a look-see.
     
  10. olivia_the_lamb

    olivia_the_lamb Moderator Staff Member

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    You really should. It will disgust you.
     
  11. Dreamscaper

    Dreamscaper Royal Hamster Wrangler

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    Unless something changed recently...
    It's not socialized healthcare, that's what it was intended to be but now its a government mandate to purchase private insurance and the insurance companies are jacking up the prices all around because of the extra 'costs'. Because I don't sleep around and have little kiddies running around I don't qualify for public insurance even though I'm dirt broke, however my history of mental illness means that my health insurance is going to be insane. So either A) I get accepted by an insurance company who is going to charge me even more (the same company that rejected the surgeon who removed my appendix before it burst and refuses to assist in paying for my medication, 92% of my monthly pay if my doc didn't continually give me free samples) or I can have no insurance at all AND get fined by the federal government for not having any. It's a major breach of law for the government to force you to purchase products from a private company.
     
  12. Sparrow

    Sparrow Well-Known Member

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    Our Supreme Court has already ruled that the major components of the "Affordable Care Act" (ObamaCare) are indeed constitutional, and with precedent. Everybody should be made to pay into a system they will inevitably use. And it has nothing to do with whether or not you sleep around.
     
  13. Dreamscaper

    Dreamscaper Royal Hamster Wrangler

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    Then the court is corrupt. Taxes are one thing, forcing private citizens to purchase a private product is blatently a violation of government power. It does, because if I had kids I would qualify for medicare and SSI, I've tried for it and been denied for that reason.
     
  14. Sparrow

    Sparrow Well-Known Member

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    The Supreme Court is decidedly conservative these days which makes the decision handed down concerning "ObamaCare" all the more honorable and uncorrupt. You already have to buy and do all kinds of things the government mandates; in fact just about everything we do or purchase is regulated, taxed, and not up for debate.

    And btw, SSI and Medicare are examples of socialism... both of which we are forced to pay into.
     
  15. Dreamscaper

    Dreamscaper Royal Hamster Wrangler

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    I don't mind regulation, I mind being fined for not having insurance that the government is working very hard to make as expensive as humanly possible. I didn't even say anything about socialism?
     
  16. Sparrow

    Sparrow Well-Known Member

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    Our government, as insanely incompetent as it can be, is trying to offer an option for those people who can't afford healthcare of any kind. Socialism is what this is all about. What do we as a people sanction our government to do on our behalf. ObamaCare is much like any other social program, it redistributes wealth and disperses the cost.

    I have no idea if ObamaCare will work in the long run or if our average healthcare costs will be better off for it. We'll have to wait and see... until then, you'll just have to pay up or be fined.:)
     
  17. olivia_the_lamb

    olivia_the_lamb Moderator Staff Member

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    Are... are you serious right now? Not everyone who has kids sleeps around. This country has one of the most warped views on sex and contraception. Not to mention, having mental illness unfortunately doesn't count as being disabled unless you're declared by the government as disabled. My friend's mother who is schizophrenic is, but the woman can't stay out of a mental hospital for longer than a few months at a time.

    If you have kids, you don't automatically qualify for SSI. I know plenty of people who have kids, need SSI, and don't get it.

    You seriously need to look into what you're talking about before you say offensive things like that.

    Also, if you're curious as to why you may have gotten turned down in the past. Go here: http://www.ssa.gov/ssi/ and take the test to see if you qualify. I took and I don't qualify, despite the fact that I could use it.


    Also, yes, ObamaCare is essentially socialized healthcare, which is why most people in America don't want it. And for all the wrong reasons.
     
  18. Dreamscaper

    Dreamscaper Royal Hamster Wrangler

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    The social security worker said this to my face. At my income level I would qualify for SSI if I had kids, I do not and therefor am disqualified for it. I would have to sleep around because I'm not married, thank you for taking my words utterly out of context.

    I fail to see how forcing people to by a product from a private company is socialism, or has the insurance industry taken over the government since I last looked? It'd be socialism if I paid the government an increase in taxes and was insured through the government.
     
    Last edited: Sep 30, 2013
  19. Sparrow

    Sparrow Well-Known Member

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    I don't get the problem here... the SSI worker was stating a fact. You seem to be inferring that the SSI worker is promoting "sleeping around" or having loose morals or perhaps buying a child off Ebay, or something, should be the route you take in order to qualify for benefits. You would do better putting aside misplaced anger and suspicion towards our government and start taking responsibility for yourself.



    In case you've just awoke from a coma, yes indeed the Insurance Lobby in this country does have tremendous sway over our State and Federal government... and btw, under ObamaCare more people will qualify for insurance via Medicare, that is socialism. Olivia is correct, ObamaCare is essentially socialized healthcare. You've heard the expression "putting lipstick on a pig"?.. that is what it is.
     
  20. olivia_the_lamb

    olivia_the_lamb Moderator Staff Member

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    How does not being married and having kids equal sleeping around? It doesn't, for starters. Telling you that you don't have kids so you don't qualify for SSI doesn't mean someone is telling you to go sleep around. They're telling you a fact, being that you don't have kids, which leads to another fact, because of it, you don't qualify.

    If you don't want someone to examine the words you're using, don't use them.