Most succesful communist model?

Discussion in 'Every Day Debating' started by Foinikas, Aug 19, 2011.

  1. Foinikas

    Foinikas Playing backgammon!

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    Ok you all know that I'm an anti-communist and you all know that communist has largely if not completely failed.But I was wondering,now that I'm watching a documentary about Mao and what he did to China during his rule(Great Leap Forward?Are you kidding me?)and having watched a documentary about Stalin a couple the other day...I'm wondering...which do you think was the least failed communist regime in the world?Which one would you choose to live in if you had to.I mean if you really had to,which one would you choose for being the best for the people no matter the serious problems and non-function ideas.
     
  2. Julie

    Julie Well-Known Member

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    I think a lot of people will answer China here but I'm gonna go with Cuba. First of all, Cuba offers good social services for all. The education and health care systems are not only free there, but also well-developed. I've heard that you run into free clinics all the time. The Cuban doctors are well-known professionals. Cuba's life expectancy rate is up to 78 y old.
    Secondly, I'm more sympathetic towards Cuba than I am towards China, because at least they don't sell out their ideology for money. China's leadership conveniently keeps all of the repressive instruments of communism to maintain power, but they don't stick to the core idea of communism, which is equality. China is, of course, richer than Cuba, but there's a big gap between rich and poor and lots of forms of inequalities against the rural population, minorities and the disabled. Political oppression and a severe lack of political rights, present in both countries, is in no way justified, but contrary to China, Cuba seem to believe "it's for a higher goal" while China.. it's for their own good, which makes me less sympathetic toward China than toward Cuba.
    Thirdly, Cuba has been considered as the best performer in Latin America when it comes to gender equality. About 40 percent of all women work in the official labor force, and they are well represented in most professions.
     
  3. Turambar

    Turambar Harebrained Staff Member

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    I would say it's a tie between hippie commune and kibbutz (which, basically, is the same).

    We had discussions like this before, I remember. I had to revise my opinion. Communism almost invariably comes with bloodshed. The russian flag is not blood red for nothing. Cuba had a hard cleansing back when it started. They do believe in the revolution as ideology - armed struggle as a teacher of morals and resolve. In the mean time, once a regime has settled, it almost invariably relies on a secret service to suppress other ideologies. There might be exceptions - China is certainly not very secretive about dealing with pockets of opposition - but Cuba is most definitely not one of them.

    I believe that communism can't work on a larger scale, because the layered structure of a souvereign state annuls the communist ideology. The top two or three echelons simply replace the elite they previously removed.
     
  4. Foinikas

    Foinikas Playing backgammon!

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    I was thinking about Yugoslavia or maybe...I don't know,Czechoslovakia or Poland?Maybe post-war Vietnam?
    Actually in all communist countries there was extreme poverty.Apart from poverty there was even bloody suppress of riots or any attempt for reform or independence.
    The Soviet Union during Stalin's reign was hell,China during Mao's reign was hell,Cambodia during Pol Pot's reign was hell.
    North Korea is one of the most oppressive countries right now,Czechoslovakia had a revolt suppressed by the Soviet Army,Hungary had an entire revolution suppressed by the Soviet Army as well.Romania suffered under Causescu,Albania was a fortress of poverty during Hoxa's rule.Cuba had a massive sugar production failure an financial problems because of Castro's dreams.
    So I'm thinking that yeah Yugoslavia was very poor too,but maybe it was better than these countries?
     
  5. Turambar

    Turambar Harebrained Staff Member

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    Yugoslavia managed to stay out of the direct grasp of Moscow - that's true. And whilst Tito reigned, the area was relatively calm. Though we haven't taken into account countries like Tanzania.

    If Yugoslavia or Tanzania would turn out to be the best communist regimes in history, I'd say it's a disqualification for communism, though :p
     
  6. Foinikas

    Foinikas Playing backgammon!

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    While Yugoslavia managed to keep its independence from the USSR and the Western world,Albania first became "independent" from the USSR and turned to China and Mao and then left China as well only to become a small country with about 200,000 bunkers,full of weapons...that became one of the poorest if not the poorest country in Europe.

    Most people think of Cuba as something romantic.Even the communists in Greece think of it as something...ideal.If Cuba fools a lot of people into thinking that communism isn't so bad there it's because of the attitude of the Cuban people towards life.They do have an amazing attitude of having fun even when they are poor.
    Many people just see the salsa,the music,the 50s cars,the beautiful buildings and they don't see behind that.They think that's all Cuba is: Romance and fun.People rarely see that Cubans take food with rations,prostitution is high,poverty is high,Castro has been ruling them for more than 40 years.
     
  7. Foinikas

    Foinikas Playing backgammon!

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    You know,after watching this,I changed my mind about Yugoslavia :p

     
  8. Mel Carriere

    Mel Carriere New Member

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    There has never been a successfull communist model. Countries like China that are nominally communist become prosperous only after they introduce free enterprise into their economies. Pure communism supresses the desire to work hard, because you don't get to enjoy the fruits of your own labor, but instead have to share them with your lazy, scumbag neighbor. From each according to his ability to each according to his need is a pipe dream that does not function in reality. All of you nascent Marxists get over it please, for the good of you, me, and everybody. Furthermore, I would like to add that a fantasy page is a very appropriate forum for the discussion of communism.
     
    Last edited: Sep 12, 2011
  9. Foinikas

    Foinikas Playing backgammon!

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    I'm an anti-communist actually and this is a thread about which communist country someone would like to live in if he had to,which was the most succesful communist country when it comes to least oppressing the people and making them happy.I know that all communist states were totalitarian and oppressive,making the people slaves to work,to produce more or less....nothing because everybody was poor in the end.
     
  10. Turambar

    Turambar Harebrained Staff Member

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    In that case: Tanzania under Nyerere ^^
     
  11. Foinikas

    Foinikas Playing backgammon!

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    I'd say Vietnam in the late 90s maybe? :p
     
  12. tuinebap88

    tuinebap88 New Member

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    I would say China; Vietnam is still consider a somewhat third world country; China have very strong foundation, its economic is strong (may be unstable but strong)
     
  13. JIM

    JIM zombie Turncoat

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    are u after straight communist, or will a socialist country do?
     
  14. Foinikas

    Foinikas Playing backgammon!

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    Hmmm...good question.But mostly communist because socialist countries like Egypt or Syria for example weren't actually that strict or didn't support the communist doctrines like countries of the Eastern Bloc of communist countries of Asia.So yeah,communist countries!