Harry Potter vs. LOTR

Discussion in 'Debates' started by Tatharlin, Dec 22, 2004.

?

Which is better?

  1. Harry Potter

    22 vote(s)
    12.9%
  2. LOTR or any Tolkien

    149 vote(s)
    87.1%
  1. Running Wolf

    Running Wolf Join the Madness

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    Elkean, you're right.
    This question is asked very often, but sometimes I think it is a waste of time...
    The reason for LotR is very clearly:
    LotR is a world!
    Between LotR and HP are lying many worlds
    HP is not even a world.
    So: LotR no doubt ;-)
     
  2. Galad

    Galad Lord of The Light.

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    I did like harry potter whilst reading it and i have to say ive never read LOTR all the way through. Ive read TTT but the fellowship bored the hell out of me when they got out of the shire but the history and beauty of tolkien (eg i loved the hobbit) is just unrivaled. so yeah LOTR wins for me.
     
  3. Plasmakid15

    Plasmakid15 Reploid Warrior

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    Hello there, *teleports to the Hogwart's school*
     
  4. Elkean

    Elkean New Member

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    I'm going to go out on a limb here and say that you voted for Harry Potter. ;)
     
  5. Mercury7674

    Mercury7674 Music House Member

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    It was hard to decide, but I had to go with Harry Potter, I admit J.K Rowling stole a lot of ideas from Tolkien, and LoTR is 100% original. However, there something magical and exciting about HP I just can't explain. About the childish thing, who cares if its a childish story? There's some grown ups that still play with trading card games! As long as you like the story, and it does something for you.

    ~Mercury7674~
     
  6. Richard Rahl

    Richard Rahl New Member

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    I completely disagree. It's absolutely ridiculous to say Rowling "stole" a lot of ideas from Tolkien, and that LotR is 100% original.

    If Rowling took any ideas from Tolkien, she certainly isn't the only one to have done so, especially since she wrote her books nearly half a century later. She just receives such criticism because she's actually successful, and many consider Tolkien to be the master of fantasy. If anything's similar to his story, they must have copied it from him :rolleyes:

    And as for LotR being 100% original, well, I read that there was some kind of German play or opera that dealt with a Dark Lord and a ruling ring, which came out before Tolkien wrote his books. He may not have copied the idea, but it wasn't original either.
     
  7. Anduril

    Anduril Flame of the West

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    I believe you're thinking of Richard Wagner's (pronounced Vagner) opera, Der Ring des Nibelungen translated commonly into English as The Ring of the Nibelung or The Nibelung's Ring which is a series of four epic operas. Both the libretto and the music were written by Richard Wagner over the course of twenty-six years, from 1848 to 1874.
    The four operas in the Ring cycle are:
    Das Rheingold (The Rhinegold)
    Die Walküre (The Valkyrie)
    Siegfried
    Götterdämmerung (Twilight of the Gods).

    The plot revolves around a magic ring that grants the power to rule the world, forged by the Nibelung dwarf Alberich from gold stolen from the river Rhine.

    Wagern's epic was so long that it had to be played over four nights. In fact, I heard that Adolph Hitler was such a fan of his music that it was banned in Germany.

    Anyways, you would be correct to say that Tolkien borrowed a lot. In fact, there's another story (forget the name) that has an epic sword that is broken and reforged, an heir to the throne, and a magical artifact that has negative effects on its bearer.

    But I think that one reason Tolkien is so well remembered is because he was the first in hundreds of years to write an epic fantasy story (that was really well written). I think what makes writers like Tolkien good is that you almost wonder if they believe they're writing real history.
     
  8. Richard Rahl

    Richard Rahl New Member

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    Indeed, thanks for that, Anduril.

    I know what you mean too. Tolkien's world and history is so in depth and thorough, it would be easy to believe it was indeed history, and not just a fictitious work of epic proportions.
     
  9. Tatharlin

    Tatharlin Daughter of a

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    Wow, I haven't checked up on this thread lately, but I must say it's wonderful to see where it's going. :)
     
  10. Luther_the_Great

    Luther_the_Great The Amazing

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    Tolkien is better than Rowling. I know there are people that disagree with this obviously, but that's ok. We live in a free country (all except for the Canadians :p ) which means that all those who disagree have the inalieable right to be wrong.
     
  11. Ariakas

    Ariakas New Member

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    LOTR and the rest of Tolkien's works is way from 100% original.

    They are heavily influenced when it comes to mythology and names from Norse and Celtic mytholgy. In the Volsung-saga there is a tale about a "cursed golden ring" and "a shattered sword which is reforged"

    Gandalf, Dwalin (Dvalin there though), Dain, Thorin and Durin are characters appearing in Edda, which is a collection of Old Norse poems. Gimli is the name of a place within the universe in Norse mythology.

    Balin is a knight from the legends of King Arthur.

    The Silmarillion's writing style is incredible similiar to the Bible. Also Tolkien was not the one who made up creatures like the Dwarves, Goblins, Trolls or Elves (although he changed them a great deal).

    LOTR is quite original. Unfortunatly so many others have made almost copies (Terry Brooks.. grrrr), while others have only been influenced to a different degree (Robert Jordan, Rowling, Eoin Colfer).



    And on-topic by the way. I enjoy the books by Tolkien much more then I enjoy the books of Rowling.
     
  12. Luther_the_Great

    Luther_the_Great The Amazing

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    I think one thing should be clear about origionality. No work of fiction is origional, they all borrow from other works. If someone tells me "the first stories were origional" I will shoot them (they were oral and not even written anyway). We all borrow things that we see that appeal to us in our work, if we write at all that is. In fact, that is what makes an author talented, their ability to build upon the foundation that others have made. An origional work is one that has taken these borrowed elements and put them together in such a way that it tells a new story, or a new version of an old story.

    One thing is certain about Tolkien's work, you will not find a compilation of those fantastic elements that he put together that tells his story except in Lord of the Rings (his other works included). Tolkien's work is unique, and that I think we can all agree upon.
     
  13. Cascador

    Cascador Who's Anakin?

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    I guess many said this before, but to ask if HP is better or LOTR is just a matter of opinion. HP as LOTR is fantasy but you cant compare it, as for many it counts as something whole different than LOTR. I'm not saying that LOTR fans can't get interested in HP. But as LoTR fans of course they will look down on the HP books as they are more meant for children.

    As a Star Wars fan I say that there aren't better films than star wars but I think deep in inside I know that there are better films. ( no not LOTR:p) sometimes I just felt like Gladiator is better...several films. It also depends in what mood I am. What interests me at the moment. It always changes opinion, so its hard to stick to one opinion. So if I was a hardcore LOTR fans and a reader of HP. I might see that HP is better but deny it because I'm trying to defend on something I always admired and cant accept that there is something in competition with it. But deep inside you know that there is competition.
     
  14. anna236

    anna236 Modern day Anna

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    LOTR, all the way! I love the history aspect of it. Tolkein made it seem like it was real history. It is very hard to do that in fantasy books. To make this other world feel like it truely could have been real, is quote amazing! I often wonder if it really did exist. After all, there was a great wave that flooded all of Beleriand, after the second age (or is it third?). How do we know that that wasn't related to the flood, in this world? There is something to ponder.
     
  15. Anduril

    Anduril Flame of the West

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    What I love about LotR is that in some ways, it was written the way every book should be written. The author wrote it for himself. He didn't try to cater to what other people liked; he just knew what he liked. Maybe this is why books like LotR, the Narnian Chronicles, and movies like Star Wars were created for the creators. George Lucas, for instance, was definitely going against the flow with Star Wars.
     
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  16. anna236

    anna236 Modern day Anna

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    My thoughts exactly. Those mentioned I definately agree! Because those people did what THEY wanted, you could see the passion more in the movie. Even if you don't like them, you have to admit that they were not compromised because they were tailored to others. *Stepping off her soap box*
     
  17. efazati

    efazati New Member

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    hello
    this is my firs post in this site !
    there is a vote in here ?
    and you want more award for harry potter ?
    i award to tolkin becuse he is the first writer in ther world ! :)
     
  18. anna236

    anna236 Modern day Anna

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    I think the percentage is about 90 to 10 in favor of Tolkien. I have only seen a few say that they voted for Harry Potter. Most people's argument is that LoTR was first, and that he wrote about a made up world, that he imagined into being, and that Harry Potter is still here on earth, and J. K. Rowling got a lot of her ideas from LoTR. The whole wizard thing was really first, in modern day by Tolkien, though it wasn't the first time. I can't remember if Merlin was before Tolkien or not, but Tolkien was the first to make it in a whole new world.
     
  19. black_dragon

    black_dragon New Member

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    i have to say LOTR i have read both books and i have also seen the movies to both. i have to say that harry potter was ok till the movies......they killed it!
    Tolkiens writting style is far more adult then J.K's although she has come along way within her writting style and skills. bottom line really is that LOTR wins by a long shot...the story is more adult etc, dont let anyone tell you that Harry Potter is better then LOTR
     
  20. fallen_phoenix

    fallen_phoenix Death Knight

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    Tolkien was more than likely inspired by Merlin, due to legends of Arthur and the Round Table. However I feel the same way as Black_dragon, LOTR was a far better book, more descriptive and a far more interesting read. J.K. is a great childrens author, but makes for a dull reading experience. And the movies did it no justice. Peter Jackson did marvelous work with the LOTR trilogy and I will even admit that the final scenes of Return of the King moved me somewhat. 3 Cheers for LOTR!!