Evolution: Right or Wrong

Discussion in 'Every Day Debating' started by havelockploz, May 21, 2004.

  1. Justice

    Justice New Member

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    Science is merely observation. One persons observation can greatly vary from the next. A majority of scientists believe in evolution. A majority once believed in other theories like the bodily humors, eugenics, and various forms of medicine which turned out to be horrifically bad for you, and yet science goes on. Our understanding changes all the time, and for someone to simply mock another system for seeing something the way you do not is... well, small minded and quite intolerant, reasons I imagine you would use against religious beliefs in general.

    One person believes the Earth is 6 billion years old. Another believes God created the Earth in a "mature" state, with starlight hitting it, dead matter in soil, etc. Neither has been observed, so therefore the best you can have on either is "faith".
     
  2. rough666

    rough666 Head of the Dept. of Evil

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    I personally think you have to be brought up with creation being taught to you as truth for it to make sense and someone accept it as reality. There is just no way you can learn about evolution with carbon-dating, and then weigh it against creation with faith, and say, "Yeah, that's probabely what happened. A god who may or may not exist made all this". I've been brought up being taught evolution through the public school system, and college reading non-faith and scientific-based text books. I am religionless, and don't believe in gods. Any gods, as most religions have different gods. Some people believe Dinosaurs existed as little as 5000 years ago. That just isn't true, but people can believe whatever they want. It doesn't affect me at all. Believe me, Justice, my mind is far from small.

    Also Justice, you refer to science as merely observation. Well religion, and the bible isn't even that.
     
  3. Lord Yuan

    Lord Yuan Death-Thousand+

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    I say that God created the universe (if there is a god) and then we evolved into what he somehow calculated us to one day be. At least that is my stance if I want to say there is God.

    If not then we just evolved more freely, without divine intervention like all the other animals.
     
  4. Killbot608

    Killbot608 prototype killing machine

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    Im a christisan so... yeah..

    But i really fiind it hard to belive that something as amazingly convenient could actually happen.
     
  5. rough666

    rough666 Head of the Dept. of Evil

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    What are you saying is convenient? Creation or evolution?
     
  6. Turambar

    Turambar Harebrained Staff Member

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    I don't think you can actually deny some parts of science - technically, that would describe a conscious process in which you have taken knowledge of that particular part, but for some reason discard it. In all, it's rather hard to discard ignore or observations.

    Personally, I would say that, by the nature of science, it's either possible to accept science (let's say - a paradigm); or challenge it, choosing, for instance, another stance or proposing another paradigm, another explanation for the same observations.
     
  7. darkfox

    darkfox New Member

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    The scientific community was floored when The Vatican announced last year that Evolution is possible. Then in October of last year the new Pope went on record about evolution and the creation of mankind.

    Pope Bendict's assessment of creation and evolution...

    There is a rub to it though. Evolution is only possible when God's hand is involved and He created us anyway. So really it's a rather cleverly composed way of saying "science isn't religion and religion is right". 2500 years of political Roman intrigue continues. Yay.
     
  8. Turambar

    Turambar Harebrained Staff Member

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    Science, happily, can't or won't judge whether God has a hand in evolution. As you mentioned, Dark, that's not Science's terrain. We can only observe - and if God can't be observed, science can't have an opinion.

    It is of course altered reasoning to fit new circumstances. The Vatican didn't get it right the first time, which should be food for thought :)
     
  9. anonymous

    anonymous the king

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    he created it by the laws of pysics
     
  10. ScreenXSurfer

    ScreenXSurfer Better Than You

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    Bah, Humbug.

    THIS IS THE TRUTH
     
  11. clouded_perception

    clouded_perception clouded_perception

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    The theory that most creationists get worked up about (unless they're explicitly YEC, many of whom have a really insane pseudo-evolution thing of their own going and disagree with the general concept entirely) isn't evolution itself -- it's the dominant theory, evolution via means of natural selection. Natural selection, by definition, removes divine interference from the equation as soon as we have a cell and an environment for it.

    Of course, it says nothing about before then, and there is no reason why somebody can't accept evolution via NS and divinely designed evolution as separate but concurrent processes (as we accept NS and genetic drift now). I think that's the Catholic Church's official stance -- that standard evolution happens but we were "designed" by their god too -- but I might be wrong.
     
  12. warrior_squirrel21

    warrior_squirrel21 blue is my favorite color

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    In the opinion of this lad,
    God made earth and all who inhabbit it. However, I believe God made only the basics of what we know as animals today, and when sin intered the world, he dispersed them. I believe he gave the animals etc., the ability to adapt to what the situation was. Therefore, evolution is real, but I seriously doubt it was any extremes like apes to humans. If that were true, God would be an ape.
    And if he is, well he's God, and he will understand my thoughts. And if he does not, then he is not God.



    (yes I DID just modify a line from Kingdom of Heaven)
     
  13. Raff the Sweetling

    Raff the Sweetling Threadkiller

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    Havent you ever seen planet of the apes? That crap is for real!
     
  14. rough666

    rough666 Head of the Dept. of Evil

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    There is no god. Shut up already.
     
  15. Justice

    Justice New Member

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    Wow, you certainly bring a lot to the table. If you don't want to read peoples opinions, then leave, we're not going to shut up for an individual like you.
     
  16. ScreenXSurfer

    ScreenXSurfer Better Than You

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    I agree with Justice. If you're just going to be an antagonistic troll, go somewhere else.
     
  17. Mububban

    Mububban Administrator Staff Member

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    Any further posts such as those that do nothing to contribute will be deleted.
     
  18. Pan.Durr

    Pan.Durr AKA Keanu

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    wow that was a lil bit of a conversation stopper.
    ...

    To get back on topic, I'm a firm believer in evolution. (that's about all I believe in too, I'm atheist for what its worth). Basically, it just makes more sense that nature had control over itself and adapts to change etc etc ON ITS OWN. It doesn't need the help of God who is essentially perfect yada yada yada.

    I also don't understand how schools in the US can refuse to teach the evolution theory. DO THESE PEOPLE HAVE NO FAITH IN THEIR CHILDREN?? If they have been raised to be the good Christians that their parents want them to be, then you'd think that, when presented with the two sides of the story, they will choose the one that supports their faith?
    Not teaching the evolution theory in science is like teaching maths without algebra. It's missing half the subject.
    Can someone tell me why people don't teach evolution theory? I really don't get how you can't...
     
  19. Mububban

    Mububban Administrator Staff Member

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    An educated mind is capable of viewing many points of view, and making its own decisions.

    Organised religion has never been fond of educating the masses or presenting other opinions. It leads to questions they don't like to have to answer. Although I agree with you, that if a person of faith learns about evolution, they will view it in the same was as an aetheist would view religious studies - it's a topic to be learnt, an alternate belief or point of view, but it's highly unlikely to change their fundamental beliefs and values.
     
  20. Pan.Durr

    Pan.Durr AKA Keanu

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    I think, in some twisted way, I was trying to say that. It just came out a bit different. So thanx for being articulate enough to say it properly =)